Mangave

[Chad]

OK, I know that since the genus Manfreda was sunk into Agave these are now all Agave hybrids, but horticulturally it is still a useful category, even if without botanical accuracy.

I've never been into spikeys, but these drew my eye and I now have four.



Which of the expanding range are others growing and what do I need to know to keep them alive?

Chad

ps. They are;
Pineapple Express
Blazing Saddles
Frosted Elegance
Silver Fox

x Semponium 'Halo' is just behind them.

[Chad]

And as an afterthought,

Of the Agave formerly in Polianthes, some of which have extraordinary flowers, how many are in UK cultivation?

Chad

[MartinNicklin]

The only one I have left. Had a few but like my less robust Agaves lost a quite a few to a combination of cold and moisture in the greenhouse. Like many, I couldn’t justify the heating costs so they had to do or die … and most chose the latter! Unsurprisingly, I was more drawn to the variegated offerings.

[Paul S]

And as an afterthought,

Of the Agave formerly in Polianthes, some of which have extraordinary flowers, how many are in UK cultivation?

Chad

Good question. I don't know anyone growing them, outside of the tuberose. Might be interesting to track some down as some have hardiness.

Edit - I'll ask Tom at Lullingstone as it is the sort of thing he might have quietly tucked away.

[Paul S]

He doesn't.

[Chad]

John tells me that the Agave formerly known as Polianthes have 'proved a challenge in cultivation'.

The Pacific Bulb Society only discusses three of the thirteen species, so I'm guessing they are 'not established' in cultivation.

Chad

[LostInJapan]

I like them because they remind me of terrestrial bromeliads. If I had a proper place to try some, I would.

The "Polianthes" look beautiful (in the pictures). Perhaps they want warmth and relatively dry conditions to thrive. Here things get too extreme - too hot and dry in summer, then too wet and cold in winter. Lots of things grow, look great, and the next cold snap or summer drought sends them over the edge.

[Andrew in Germany]

These are the offsprings from a 3rd generation in my keeping, some 20 years. The one has flowered, setting seed and pups are arriving at its base giving me the 4th generation. I've got a few more sitting in pots as I can't be so heartless as to toss them out in mid-vigour.

I've always referred to them as Manfreda 'Macha Mocha' , are they now Mangave Macha Mocha?



There's a lot of battling for real estate starting up in this bed. I'm going to leave them to it. Just looking at it gives me bloody hands
These all stay in situ over the winter with overhead cover to keep them dry. But they have to put up with winter temperatures on their own. Rarely does one die... from the winter ;)

[Chad]

I've always referred to them as Manfreda 'Macha Mocha' , are they now Mangave Macha Mocha?

Oh now you've asked...

'Macha Mocha' arose from a batch of wild collected Manfreda variegata.  A few of the seedlings were very different, even though they arose from the same seed parent. 

Originally suspected to be a tetraploid  Manfreda variegata, it was then thought to have been a natural hybrid with Agave celsii. That gave the intergeneric name xManfreda.

Further hybrids have been done on purpose with Manfreda, Agave and Polianthes.

Then Manfreda and Polianthes were amalgamated into Agave.  So botanically all the 'hybrids' are Agave.  Mangave has a persistent use for the horticultural group of what were hybrids, since they behave differently from 'normal Agave'. 

The situation isn't fixed though.  There has been a suggestion to split up 'traditional' Agave, in which case the 'other' genera may be resurrected. 

At the moment, I would call 'Macha Mocha' a  xMangave to a horticulturist, and an Agave to a botanist. 

Paul, does the Mexican suggested to split  Agave look like it has traction?

Chad

[Andrew in Germany]

Oh now you've asked...

At the moment, I would call 'Macha Mocha' a  xMangave to a horticulturist, and an Agave to a botanist. 

Thank you Chad.
I think to remain clear for now, I should continue to use the name I've been using for decades!

( :lol: Because (tongue in cheek) when discussing this I can never really be sure of whom I'm addressing; be it a horticulturist intermingled with a few genes of botany or some other personal hybrid and then the whole thing gets confused...
Humour aside, clearly the pursuit of clarity starts with confusion and then all becomes clear in the clearing of confusion. That, in a nutshell, is the point of the internet, or might be. :lol:)